Tuesday 15 August 2023

Back from Ireland



When I look at this picture it reminds me of my teenage years in Malta, when we would go down stony paths that wound through ancient stone fortifications, and then swim off the rocks at the shore.  But if this had been Malta, I'd have taken the photo in winter or early spring, because the flowers in the foreground would have been long gone by the time the blazing hot summer arrived.  

Anyway, as the title of my post suggests, this picture doesn't show long-ago Malta. It shows an Irish scene - a view from the coastal path towards Charles Fort, at Kinsale, Co. Cork.  The water around the coast of West Cork is beautifully clear, and half a dozen people in the sea were clearly having a wonderful time, even though the water probably wasn't too warm. Even the sunshine didn't last, because Irish weather changes by the minute, and two hours later the scene was foggy!  

I've been wanting to get to Ireland ever since I got my Irish citizenship during the Covid pandemic and I finally made it earlier this month. 


I'm really proud of my Irish passport, which I am eligible for because I had an Irish grandfather.  (Both my grandfathers were Irish, in fact,  but one happened to be born in England).  This is the grandfather in question:  my dad's dad, Richard, who was born in Kilkenny. 


Many of my male ancestors were in the army, or in jobs that required them to travel around.  They came from poor backgrounds, where the only alternatives to trusting your luck in the big wide world were (a) labouring in awful jobs on the city or (b) labouring on the farm, both of which were often just another way of being cruelly exploited.  One of the big attractions of the army was that you could rely on steady pay and getting fed.  And who knows, you might come across some interesting opportunities in your travels. 

As far as I know, nobody in my family was ever stationed in Charles Fort, though they may well have stayed in places like it.   It's very well preserved, and we had a good guided tour of the site, which made me feel  specially interested in the family quarters.  I have put a pink arrow on this photo, which ....

...marks the fort's arsenal -  that building with the pointy roof .   It was packed to the rafters with explosives and guarded 24 hours a day. Any soldier who needed to enter it, for whatever reason, had to strip down and put on a linen smock and wear wooden clogs on his feet, an outfit considered to be less inflammable than his regular uniform.   

The soldiers' married quarters are just opposite the arsenal! The building would have been crowded with women and children as well as soldiers, so they'd have been the first to go up in smoke if there'd been an explosion. You can't see the officers' quarters in this picture since they were separated from the arsenal by a huge wall.  It might not have protected them much, but perhaps it made them feel safer. 

 It's generally thought that only officers were allowed to take their families with them on their travels but according to our guide, some soldiers also got the opportunity to have the family along, even if it did mean living next to the gunpowder.   My great-great-great grandad seemed as if he may have been one of these.  Apparently, soldiers had to enter a lottery if they wanted to be accompanied, and if they drew a winning ball, the family would be provided for.   Their wives and daughters cooked and cleaned, while the sons were either enrolled as soldiers as soon as possible, or became bugle-boys or other undesirable jobs.  There was no privacy and several families lived together in one huge room.   But still better, it seems, than staying back home on the farm. 

My great-great-great grandfather's name was John Harper, and he was born in Halesworth, Suffolk. His wife was called Catherine Miniter, who had been born in Scarriff, Co. Clare. The pair married when they were both in Canada, so Catherine's father, (who was also born in Co. Clare) was almost certainly a soldier too. In that case, she'd have been well used to the military life, and the nine children she and John produced all survived to adulthood, even though every one was born in a different part of Ireland, England or Canada.  

 I tried to imagine her travelling to and across the Atlantic with the children - almost certainly in steerage - pregnant a lot of the time and frequently suffering Canadian winters into the bargain.  As well as this, the Fenian wars and other instability were plaguing Canada - which I suppose is why my great-great-great grandad and his father-in-law were out there in the first place.  Sadly, I don't know where and when Catherine died, but I hope she got back to Clare eventually, like her dad apparently did.   

"Miniter" is an unusual name which still survives in Clare. Many Irish records before 1850 have been destroyed but the name may be Norman French in origin, and I have the beginnings of a plan to visit Scarriff on my next trip to see what kind of a place Clare is.   

To return to Kinsale, it's the site of a battle which changed the course of English and Irish history.   Walk along that lovely coastline and you'll come across a few signs like this.... 

...and if you like military history,  here's more information.   

The town of Kinsale today could hardly be more different from how it was then.    Now, it is a pretty old place, with houses painted up in many colours, and a lively "foodie" culture. They're proud of their Michelin-starred restaurant, "Bastion" and there are several other highly rated restaurants offering  different cuisines, not to mention great artisan ingredients to buy.     How times change, eh? 

Here's one other photo that I liked taking at Charles Fort.  These structures are by the main gate are connected with the water supply, but I love their simple and satisfying shapes.  I just wonder how they worked. Were they bases for wooden water tanks? Or did the troughs fill with water? Is that a well in the middle of each one? 

In the end,  Charles Fort rather fizzled out. It only saw combat once, in 1690, when it was  attacked by King William of Orange.   After a thirteen day siege, King Billy breached the walls, helped (according to the guide who showed us around) by a sleazy sounding guy who had supervised building the fort in the first place. Not only had that man creamed off money from the building for himself, but he also told the enemy that the eastern walls hadn't been properly built, so naturally William concentrated his attacks there.    

After this, Charles Fort lingered on and eventually fell into ruin. It's now run by the Irish Office of Public Works, which I can't imagine will ever give it up or sell it on. Before they took it on, though, the fort had a brief period in the 1970s when it ws occupied by a hippy encampment.  That's the time I'd have liked to known it.   What a nice spot to go and sit and think about peace & love, have a nice swim on a hot day, and look out at the ever-changing sea. 

 
  

45 comments:

  1. This is amazing history. Not something you can just come across without the research people like you put in. Thank you. My own partly Irish history, grandmother from Tipperary, is so clouded in memories and assumptions, and concealment -- she married an Englishman, shock! that I can't really reconstruct it.

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    1. Thanks, Boud. I found out quite a lot from something called IrelandXO which has message boards to help people trying to trace IRish ancestors and is run by volunteers. Mainly it has to be done from documents, and as you say, personal memories can be more of a help than a hindrance!

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  2. Yes. That first photo really does look like Malta. Lovely pics. Enjoyed reading it. My own granny is from the west coast of Ireland.

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    1. Thanks Liam. I am glad you enjoyed reading the post. I hope you've managed to make a trip to the West of Ireland.

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    2. Hello Jenny. I haven't been to Galway since I was a child. I should make a trip in the coming years. I am just about to start the Bar course in London, and my final stage to becoming a qualified barrister. As soon as I start taking on clients, I can travel a bit more. Haha. Otherwise, I am in two-minds on getting an Irish passport. Obviously this is just my own view, but I sort of feel that I would owe a duty of loyalty to a country that gave me a passport. Merh, I don't know. I feel a bit ambivalent. Anyway, I do like your blog. I was just reading your Turin trip and made me want to add another destination to my enormous never-ending list. :)

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    3. My own reasons for acquiring Irish citizenship were quite emotional but for you it sounds like you might perhaps widen your life options with it? I don't mean just travelwise, but depending on your legal speciality, perhaps work too. Not that I know your circumstances! But I believe UK lawyers who do a lot of EU law have kept most practising rights after Brexit but it's still easier for them if they are based in an EU country. Yeah, you are right, you can't feel loyal to anywhere if you don't know it but if you lived there a while loyalty would probably follow as you made friends and got to know it. That kind of stuff is really personal tho!!! Yes, there's lots to see not just in Turin but IMO Genoa was even better. Sadly I didnt get around to writing that up on this blog.

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  3. You know so much about your own history and the history of the land. Beautiful place to have been home for your ancestors. Mine were from Sweden but I know nothing about them.
    What a sleazy guy!!
    I wonder, too, what those octagon shaped thingies were for? Would have been a wonderful spot to live the hippie life--yes! LOL!

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    1. Yes, I felt quite envious of those hippies, what a place to live with your friends!

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  4. Half my great grandparents were Irish immigrants. I've been fairly successful in tracing them, but wonder if I will ever answer the question, why did my grandfather (still all Irish) marry my grandmother (still all Irish). My father would not talk of his parents, and what I know is not great.

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    1. The only way to get a clue is find someone who knew them all in another branch of the family. T. found recently that his grandad had left his family in England to become a revolutionary in Germany and his grandma had to go to Germany to get him back! wow. But his mother had never said a word!

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  5. I'm so glad you got to go to Ireland! It's a place I've wanted to visit. My mother's side of the family might have had some connection to it, but it would have been long ago.

    How difficult life has been for so many through the years. I'm always humbled when I read historical accounts of people's true work and living conditions in the past.

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  6. Yes, I can see why you think of Malta (not that I have been there, but seen pictures), and it is dear old Ireland. Congratulations on your new citizenship, how exciting. I have some Irish ancestry but more of the Great or Great, Great grandparentage. However, we do now have our Irish daughter in law, and the darling half Irish twins and their tiny sister. I am quite the fan of Irishness these days. Charles Fort looks fascinating and well preserved. Also dangerous, with everyone close to the gunpowder. The water system is beautifully designed and made, however it works. Things were made to last back then. It sounds like you are working on your genealogy, and good for you. My husband is the expert in our house, and sometimes he does a bit of mine as well :) Lovely post, and looking forward to your next Irish trip.

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    1. I wonder what you'd think of Ireland if you went. It's just about the opposite of Australia and Canada with a very mild climate and teeny weeny little roads winding past always-green small fields !

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  7. Relatively retiring16 August 2023 at 07:59

    A fascinating post, Jenny. Worth waiting for the Irish passport, and ploughing through the necessary research. The lives of ancestors bring a wonderful new dimension to our lives today.

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    1. I'm always amazed at how tough they had to be to survive. But then most of mine were poor. Even the better off ones didn't always have it easy, mind you!

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  8. Interesting reading and a troubled history.
    I am one generation too far to get an Irish passport unfortunately . I will have to tell my daughter about IrelandXO...she has been stumped by the name Michael Falvey....there were too many with the same name in the right place at the right time!

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    1. I had a similar issue with some of my English relations on that side - coal miners in Northumberland. Huge families intermarrying constantly, lodging with each other and with only half a dozen names between them it seems!

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  9. What an interesting place! And anyone who longs after the "good old times" should easily understand from all this that the old times were never all that "good", especially not if you were not wealthy. Much of that is still true today, but even the poorest household in the "Western" world is better off than many of the people could dream of back then, I believe.
    As for the water supply structure, could it be that the outer ring was meant for horses to drink from, while the water for human consumption (drinking and cooking) was to be taken from the inner part?

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    1. I wondered about them being for the horses, too, since they'd have needed somewhere to drink, but they seemed rather close together for that. Donkeys maybe could have managed but they'd only have used those for labouring work. I didn't notice any stables in the fort though so I think they must have been foot soldiers stationed there or something.( You know, I'm not sure I know enough about military history, trying to answer your question is raising more questions for me! Maybe I should investigate further)

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  10. Congratulations on your Irish passport, Jenny. I am assuming that you also have a British passport and that you are a citizen of both countries. Do you plan to travel using the Irish passport or the British one. There is a long history of a Irish immigration to Canada as you point out, and there was often a good deal of conflict between Catholics and Protestants (of course that continues to this day as people worshipping from the same holy text happily kill and maim each other), and many small towns were known as either Catholic or Protestant towns, and the Orange Parade was a major event, fostering strife and enmity. In Québec the Irish and the French intermarried, both being Catholic, of course, and it is common today to to encounter people with names like Jean-Marc Kelly, Pierre Mulroney, and so on. The Elliott side of our former Prime Minister Pierre Elliot-Trudeau was Irish.

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    1. Yes, David, I don't want to give up UK citizenship, and I hope we'll soon have a new government to start the long road back from the catastrophe of the last few years. The Irish passport is largely symbolic, it matters to me to claim that part of my identity and although an Irish EU passport is far more useful than a UK one, that's not relevant to me right now. I didn't know much about Canadian history before looking into these ancestors, and your comments about the Irish-French links are interesting. I hadn't realised some of what you say at all.

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  11. Kinsale is a nice little town. Jenny and I visited it on a long-ago drive around the Irish coast. But I've never seen Charles Fort, so thanks for the background info. Jenny also has an Irish passport, for similar reasons to your own.

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    1. When I was young and lived in Co. Down we holidayed on the west coast and I'm impressed at the incredible progress Ireland has made since then. There was awful poverty but all that's gone and it's apparently more prosperous than England now, all I spoke to credited the EU. You in Northern Ireland seem to have a better deal than the rest of us, and I've been vaguely assuming companies have been flocking to Belfast to take advantage - is that so? I don't really know.

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    2. Whether companies are flocking to Belfast, I don't know. But there are a host of very successful firms in the city. Belfast Council says "Belfast is home to thriving clusters of high growth companies, with significant strengths in creative and digital, financial and professional services, cyber technology and advanced engineering and manufacturing." Office rents and salary costs are appreciably lower than in other countries.

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  12. An Irish passport! How lucky for you! No queues at airports now. Another Brexit benefit! Ireland's west coast must be marvellous to visit, in good weather. I can see that fort in mist and rain. No idea what regiment that is, but so many jined up in the past, my dad also, because there was no work. It was one way to see the world, otherwise you saw little of it. IN London a neighbour was from Cork area, we never understood a word he said! Glad you had such a good time away.

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    1. The passport has many advantages but so far I haven't used them as I have travelled with T. and he only has a British one. If I ever wanted to settle in the EU I could bring him along, though. The West coast is really amazing. The weather changes so fast that I kind of give up worrying about it. Our twin grandkids who are half Irish now have an English and an Irish accent which they switch between. I hadn't realised this till I heard them in Ireland !

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    2. I can imagine the kids using two accents, for a laugh! Good on them!

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  13. Thank you for the military history link....it's a long time since I studied Elizabethan Ireland and the later Flight of the Earls. I imagine that since Brexit the Irish passport offices have had to engage more staff!
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    1. There do seem to be a lot of people who now have the passports through dredging up long forgotten Irish grannies but have never visited. Still, it's no skin off Ireland's nose if they gain more sensible citizens who want to be international, I suppose. I don't approve of those who were staunch public Brexiters pulling the ladder up behind them but sadly there's no way of weeding out the Brexiters now.

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  14. Love the Irish passport! Now, promise us you will show us the colour changing loos you experienced!

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    1. Yes, luckily I took photos and I have another post half written! so it will go in there.

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  15. Oh Jenny, what a terrific review of your past and of this part of Ireland. I'm so excited you now have an Irish passport as well -- a part of heritage, if that makes sense. I was fascinated by the stories of your greats and the Fort. I can see why even though it might have been hard work, women and children had a better life there than on the farm. And I love that you know the history of this area and the battles of the past. It's beautiful territory -- that last photo looked like a little bit of heaven. Your grandfather was a handsome man -- and it's not just the uniform! I loved your description of childhood in Malta, too, jumping from the rocks. What a playground you had if it looked like this beautiful Irish view!

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    1. Thanks for your comments, Jeanie. I think my grandpa looks rather handsome too. He is very similar looking to my dad, and I suspect might have been as mischievous as Dad could be, too,

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  16. It is wonderful that you were able to get citizenship and have so much heritage. Richard was a handsome guy!

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    1. Thank you, e! I never met him as he died before I was born, but he sounded like fun.

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  17. Interesting historical trip in Ireland that you shared with knowledge of being there. I'm glad you were able to get a passport for Ireland. We had thought about going to Ireland when we were in England years ago but not good time 1978. Scotland was good though.

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    1. I had last visited Ireland 2017. I meant to revisit before but COVID happened and then they went through a period when the cost of car hire went through the roof.

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  18. Jenny, congratulations on your Irish citizenship. Now it will be easier and cheaper for you (without a visa) to travel around Europe. Interesting family history. I think you have done a lot of research to find out what an amazing story it is. I don't and never had any relatives in Ireland, or so I think. I love your photos from your trip to Ireland.

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    1. Thanks Nadezda. I am writing another post about Ireland which I will put up soon. I was surprised there was a lot to see in West Cork.

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  19. My paternal grandparents came to Australia from the little township of Armagh, County Armagh, Northern Island and settled in Rockhampton, central Queensland. My father was born in Rockhampton. My maternal side is Scottish Highlanders.

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    1. You sound as if you are have some pretty strong Gaelic roots Lee! (I accidentally wrote "garlic roots" - kind of appropriate for such a good cook LOL. ) I think there is a great diaspora of people who were displaced in the last few centuries, and many of their descendants may feel rather glad they left!

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  20. How lovely to see a part of Ireland that I'm not at all familiar with. My great-grandparents were Irish but born in Wales, the family had moved to England by the time my grandmother was born. Guess it's just British and South African passports for me.

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    1. It's well worth visiting West Cork, Mandy. It is obviously doing very well in that it looks prosperous and there is clearly money around. So long as it is kept in balance and doesn't price out the local people, I am all for that.

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  21. I can go one better both my parents were Irish so in threory was so am I, I tought about getting an Irish Passport but at the time Dad said it was more hassle than it was worth (customs) I could still get one and offten think about it but I don't go overseas now. My Grandad was in the Irish Guards

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  22. Congratulations on your Irish passport :)

    All the best Jan
    https://thelowcarbdiabetic.blogspot.com/

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